Frequently Asked Questions about Clubs and Technique
I am frequently answering e-mails and taking phone calls to answer questions from people who are taking up the art of club swinging. I welcome this exchange with folks who have a similiar passion and want to advance their learning. There is little known about the traditional methods of this exercises. To the best of my knowledge and experience, I will try and answer questions that come my way.
Below is an email I sent to someone who was asking me about club sizes.
As you have probably discovered, swinging clubs is not like lifting
weights. People ask me all the time about the weight of my clubs or the size that I use. Let me start off by sharing my philosophy on health and fitness. It's simple - enjoy yourself. Simple as that, just enjoy whatever it is you get involved in. I do not compete with anyone, I have no desire to nor do I need to.
If you swing too heavy for your body type, prior conditioning and age, you will get injured. The idea I follow is to prevent injury, not create one. For some reason, I have found that Americans all want to boast about there lifts or about the weight they are swinging while using clubs. Some older and much wiser Persians that taught me all said to not lift heavy clubs or you will injure your shoulder. All of them warned me of this. Although heavy meels are swung by some men in contests overseas, this is not the daily activity or the regime the Iranians or I follow. I was told repeatedly "heavy clubs will injure the shoulder joint". I do have a couple of large pairs of clubs. These clubs are so large, that in fact, no one but the local Palavan Yousefi from Iran has been able to lift or swing both of them together that has attempted it here in my home in California. However, there are two men, both Pahlavans, at a local gym here that have been able to swing my larger 29 lb 32 inch long clubs. Both these men are champion wrestlers and both hold many wrestling awards in Iran. Both men weigh over 270 lbs and are strong as bulls. When I say strong, I mean whole body strong, wrestling strong, and have functional strength. In my view, club swinging should be smooth, fluid and easy. A comfortable weight allows us to be able to do hundreds of repetitions not small sets of 20 or 50. It is like riding a bike. We start off awkward, then learn the movements in full range, and then progress to heavier weights. With these slightly heavier weights it does not mean we then fall back into swinging with jerky and troublesome movements. If you are struggling or feeling pain, lighten the weight and become fluid before progressing. Concentrate on stretching the shoulder and use lighter clubs. Remember, this is not a contest. I stretch my shoulder joints and hands every morning while taking a hot shower. I let the hot water run down onto the shoulder joint while I stretch. Warm up before swinging follows the Persian tradition of doing the push ups first. The Persians always do Veresh-e-Bustane which is a whole routine not just swinging the clubs as most people today think. Even in Indian, they warm up first, then do push-ups or dands before they swing the clubs or the gada. I personally do a lot of shoulder stretching before club swings. I put a whole series of shoulder stretches on my Light Club swinging DVD. I then swing 2 lb clubs along with push-ups and isometrics before getting involved with the clubs. I do not lift any heavy weights or kettle bells. I do however use heavy bands almost daily. I do whatever is fun for me. I am 65 years old and have never been injured throughout the years with any exercise that I practice. I trained elephants for most of my professional life and I have been injured in the business. An elephant crushed my shoulder 35 years ago. I had limited movement and took up the clubs as well as stretching to release the discomfort of a frozen shoulder. I started with stretching. I just let the clubs hang in the position that you want to stretch. The only advice I will give you strongly is do not do what I see on YouTube. People on there are swinging 40 pound clubs with one hand in full rotations. In my opinion, this is a recipe for disaster. If you cannot swing a club size of any weight in pairs for at least 5 minutes you are
probably using too heavy of a weight. Clubs will give the shoulder a workout. They can increase strength, flexibility, endurance, and speed. They can protect the joint in all four planes if the movements are controlled and done sensibly. I cannot comment on what one exercise is the best. I can tell you what is not good, and that is if you feel pain.
I hope this e-mail has been helpful. I do not claim to be the one and only expert. I consider my self simply as a source. I have done my research and none of the folks I have trained in the clubs have reported injury under my tutelage. Many have reported beneficial results. I will continue to learn more and do more research.
Quick question - How does bench pressing 600 lbs relate to throwing a baseball or riding a bicycle or carrying fire wood? I know it is an accomplishment for these guys, but in my world it would never have served me well. Working on the circus we threw hundreds of bales of hay, drove tent stakes with a 20 lb sledge hammer, and shoveled tons of elephant dung daily. These activities were work and they developed functional strength that worked the core, back, legs, arms and grip. Or in other words, it worked all planes. Is this not like life itself, multidimensional? How is bench pressing multidimensional? As I said, you do what turns you on. If bench pressing 700 lbs is your goal, by all means go for it. As I remember, Bruno Sammartino as well as many other power lifting champions are huge. Of course, a larger person with greater trained muscle mass can lift more then someone who does not. Remember age has a lot to do with what you can or more importantly should do. Genetics has a lot to do also with what we have the potential to perform.—Richard “Army” Maguire
India's Joris or Meels ?
Meels on left and Jori on the right both weighing 10lbs
Some one recently asked me the difference between Indian and Persian clubs.
Well persian clubs usually are known as meels where as Indian clubs can go by many names depending apon the regian they are from. Jori are usually large clubs. This word Jori can also refer to a wrestling style.
Lookin g closely at the photo you will see the shapes vary a bit. The usual indian style or shape of clubs is more cone shaped. The corners at the bottom of the Persian meels is usually curved or rounded . I personally believe the reason the Meels have a rounded bottom is so the wood will not chip or break odd at the sharp corners. In India large clubs 5 foot tall are often banded at the bottom with steel or iron collars . This was to keep the wood from chipping or breaking off when dropped due to the heavy weights. This also of course added additional weight.These large metal bands increased the weights considerably. All clubs seem to have more or less a taper . This helps in clearing the shoulders and makes the act of swinging the long pendulum of wood better.
At light weights of 8- 15 lbs their really is not a lot of difference in the ability to swing meels as opposed to a Jori.
By the way Jori means pair in Hindi. .
Well persian clubs usually are known as meels where as Indian clubs can go by many names depending apon the regian they are from. Jori are usually large clubs. This word Jori can also refer to a wrestling style.
Lookin g closely at the photo you will see the shapes vary a bit. The usual indian style or shape of clubs is more cone shaped. The corners at the bottom of the Persian meels is usually curved or rounded . I personally believe the reason the Meels have a rounded bottom is so the wood will not chip or break odd at the sharp corners. In India large clubs 5 foot tall are often banded at the bottom with steel or iron collars . This was to keep the wood from chipping or breaking off when dropped due to the heavy weights. This also of course added additional weight.These large metal bands increased the weights considerably. All clubs seem to have more or less a taper . This helps in clearing the shoulders and makes the act of swinging the long pendulum of wood better.
At light weights of 8- 15 lbs their really is not a lot of difference in the ability to swing meels as opposed to a Jori.
By the way Jori means pair in Hindi. .
Jori swings with steel band at the bottom of the huge clubs.